Louisana Diaster / Christian Government [Archive]

seven

09-03-2005, 01:29 AM

>>Flyboy<<

09-03-2005, 01:01 PM

Watching the news is so disturbing. Calling the survivors of this horrific diaster "Looters"???

Where are the Christians in our Government? Isn't Jesus' message to help the sick and the poor? To not judgment on people but to love and try to understand them?

Where are the Christians?
Where is the Government?

They claim to be one... but in the face of a tragic diaster you see polticians dumbfounded doing NOTHING for the victims... The news media have been in Louisana waiting for 4 days... but our government can not get any of our Troops or National Guards to drop these victims (looters ) some freakin water! Food! Have some empathy for these starving, homeless people!!

What kind of response, from our strongly faith based CHEIF OF COMMANDER who rants and raves how important it is for him to make sure Americans are safe.... surrounding himself with government officials that instead of MOVING INTO IMMEDIATE ACTION or better yet, should have been prepared for this hurricane that everybody knew was going to hit, but instead of leading sits there defending,

"let's not put blame on anybody, there is no way to be prepared for a diaster this tragic"

or

"looting will not be tolerated!"

Our President needs to step aside and let someone who does have a way to be prepared or who has more productive ways of handling such tragidies than defending his inability to get the job done!

He wants the respect and power to be our President but none of the responsibility! What is going on?????

Will this even "wake the people up" to how incompetent he is? Yes, people love him for his morality and his christianity... What about job performance?

He says that there will be success overcoming this tragidy - he has already failed... how can you take so long, and how many people died, waiting for you to respond???

He's pretty good at planning vacations.... maybe he should work as a vacation planner instead!

IF YOU AREN'T OUTRAGED... YOU NEED TO START PAYING ATTENTION!!!![/

OH GIVE ME A BREAK YOU TYPICAL BLEEDING HEART MORON!!!! It's one thing to be desperiate for food and water, its another thing when you see these "poor survivors" running down the street with TVs, 10 pairs of Levis and Nikes while they break into jewelery stores and attempt to take whole ATM machinese and then they start SHOOTING AT THE RESUCUE HELICOPTERS!!! ARE THEY YOU'RE POOR SURVIVORS!!!!! THOSE PEOPLE ARE ANIMALS, THEY DESERVE TO DIE AND BURN IN HELL:rolleyes:

LOOTING SHOULD NOT BE TOLERATED AND I HOPE THOSE WHO ARE SHOOTING AT HELICOPTERS AND BREAKING INTO BUSINESSS TO STEAL TVS, CLOTHING AND JEWELERY ARE SHOT ON SITE UNTIL THEY ARE DEAD!!!!

And to answer your claim about the slow response - even after the storm hit, the weather was still horrible and any large airlift couldn't be undertaken anyway. Check the national weather service and look at the weather the days after the hurricane! Gusty winds, showers, poor visability. The news helicopters flying after the storm were were initally taking a hell of a chance, but if you had a half a brain and stopped making this a political issue you would know this!!!!!!!!

I'm outraged cause there are folks like you making stupid remarks like this! There are thousands of good people who suffered during this tragedy BUT THERE ARE ALSO A BUNCH OF IDIOTS THERE WHO DESERVE TO DIE, EITHER BY FLOOD OR A SOLDIERS BULLET!!!!

The greater New Orleans population is 1,337,726 - most of those people evacuated in 5 days - I think that's pretty darn good!!!!

It doesn't matter if Bush or Kerry was in the white house, the response would of been the same. Why don't you direct your questions to the local and state governments who should of been the first ones to react to this tragedy? Why did it take the governor so long to ask for federal help (The Federal Government doesn't repond until requested). Why don't you question why the Lake Ponchatrain leveys weren't reinforced years ago as a STATE PROJECT, and why don't you question why a good number of New Orleans cops walked off their posts when they were needed the most!!!!

EVIDENTLY YOU WERE NOT PAYING ATTENTION IN HIGH SCHOOL GOVERNMENT OR YOU WOULD HAVE A CLUE ABOUT THE WAY GOVERNMENT WORKS!

To make this a political issue is like blaming the weather man cause it rained. You bleeding hearts have nothing else to grab on to so naturally you'll blame the President when the root of the problem has nothing to do with the federal government! Go read a book and get a half a brain and maybe you'll begin to make some sense!

Oh where are the Christians? - They've been there from the start! Numerous christian organizations were the first to react to this tragedy, for example, my mother in law is on her way down to Mississippi with her church to spend 10 days there giving out food - she is one of many christians and christian groups who reacted immediately - Again your comment "Where are the Christians" is just a bench mark of your stpidity!!!!

cob1639

09-03-2005, 08:20 PM

No matter how good Bush does anything - liberals will NEVER see him as a good leader.

No matter how bad Bush does anything - conservatives will NEVER see him as a bad leader.

Nothing that either side could say will EVER pursuade the other. Bush as a subject of debate is a waste of energy.

Jennifer Aniston and Brad Pitt's divorce - THAT'S a debate. He was like so wrong for like seeing Angelina Jolie like behind her back!
O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-03-2005, 09:30 PM

seven

09-04-2005, 01:13 AM

Once again... as I mentioned earlier to the Flyboy in the Religion Forum, that just because my opinion differs from yours, does not mean that I am to ignorant to have formed my own opinion.

And Once again, I referred to how easy it is to direct blame and emotionally direct it at one target. This is what happened after watching the news hearing children speak stories of watching people dying and seeing a picture of a woman with diapers and formula referred to being seen after looting a grocery store.

If this makes me a moran with a bleeding heart for witnessing this reality, so be it! Believe me, I was not crying for the criminals who were stealing TV's and radio's but rather questioning where they thought they would be plugging them in or what a hassle it would be to lug electronics around with them while trying to escape diaster.

Might I also add that I couldn't care less about any stupid TV's or whatever else the losers in all this are stealing... There is way more important shit to be focused on and angry about than some idiots commiting burgerly! As far as the armed punks, give me a moment, I'll get to that too.

I agree that the Mayor and Governer should have prepared for, what the weather man forcasted would be, a devestating Hurricane that would no doubt leave a diaster of destruction, but with that said...

FEMA is a Federal Government Agency.

This Administration dowgraded FEMA from a Cabnit position and merged it into Homeland Security which proves that there was little if any respect for our Federal Emergency Agency to begin with.

Adding insult to injury Bush appoints two of his homies, Joe Allbaugh and Mike Brown, who have NO EXPIERENCE on Diaster Management. How in the world do you appoint two people the head of our Federal Diaster Mangement Agencey with absolutely none, zero, zilch,... expeirence in any management of any diasters????

seven

09-04-2005, 01:13 AM

Unlike 9/11, this was not a suprise attack. A hurricane in itself takes approximately 2 weeks to accumulate, They knew it was coming... it came... and excuse me if I might be a litte offended when I see them pretending that they couldn't have known.

If this is true, they need to step aside for the people that can. If they did know, than they are lying to us... bottom line.

They cut and slashed a budget for Fema that was directed towards any hurricanes or thunderstorms that they knew, with scientific certainty, would jeopardize the safety of Louisiana residents because they are weapons of mass destruction... especially with the global warming going on around the world.

It is also a scientific fact that the warmer the climate, the faster, more destructive, and deadlier a hurricane or thunderstorm is generated. No big secret how warm the climate is in Louisana. You don't have to be a Rocket Scientist to put one and one together! :mad:

The questions that I ask are simple and as an American who pays my taxes I feel I have the right to demand answers to the questions I am asking.

The Head of Homeland Security stated that it was critical to have the people evacuate the city before the storm and it's to bad for those who didn't listen.

The ninth lower ward where most of the devestation occurred, 120,000 of their residence make less than $8,000 a year, 40 percent of the community live is poor stricken proverty. Most did not have transportation, money for gas or transportation, or family and friends they could flee to for safety.

I agree that some were criminals before the hurricane because they're always gonna be those ones.... but the the sheer magnitude of the suffering and death the people were consumed in would cause them to be mentally imbalanced on top of surviving this horrific hurricane and that is going to cause some insane behavior.

This kind of mixture is exactly why there should have been protection for the people that were going to be trapped with this insanity surrounding them.

seven

09-04-2005, 01:14 AM

Our Government is suppose to do the big things we can not do... PROTECTION and INFRANSTRUCTURE.

As far as you being satisfied with some of the people who deserve to die and furthering your hopes that they burn in Hell...

It is definately not my place to decide who should have a chance to repent and be forgiven for any mistakes they have made under circumstances that are unknown to me.

When I question where the Christians were, I was not criticizing your mother-in-law or Christian organizations. As a matter of fact, I was not criticizing Christians (and not impressed by the way you tried to spin it).

I believe true Chistian values do not hope and condemn people to Hell, do not value theirselves as superior and look down at other people as less deserving, and do not in any way support,ignore, or validate any suffering.

Actually, I was referring to our government representing and basing their values on Christanity but only hearing them make voices of condemnation.

I was giving attention to the hyprocrisy in Republican Extremist and (especially after speaking to you) Christian Extremist.

My brother is a US Marine and a devote Christian who risked his life in the Middle East under extreme weather conditions and survived a bullet to the head serving and protecting what this country stands for which includes my right to have an opinion.

I am fully aware of what our Government Military are prepared to overcome, so you can keep your crap on the the weather conditions after the hurricane hit Louisana or a few petty criminals firing at them as a reason any of our Military Branches who were trained to Serve and Protect us didn't get there sooner!

Lemme guess.... my disappointments with or questioning the incompetance of the response to this disaster makes me unpatriotic??? Give me a freaking break!

FYI>>> Jesus was crucified for speaking out against > what was the government of his time> their lack of attention to the people who were suffering! :eek: Go ahead, check your bible!

seven

09-04-2005, 01:19 AM

As for Brad, he should have worked out Angelina and Jennifer together. But you know me.... If I had to pick, well besides being an Embassador of the UN and installing all those water wells in Africa, you know... she's was my girl before all that! :D

cob1639

09-04-2005, 01:41 AM

All this crap will be solved with my idea. WAR ON HURRICANES.

I'm not letting this one go Flyman!

My fellow Americans:
We have recently been hit by a cowardly enemy. A freggin bitch, named Katrina. I have prepared to mobilize all of our military strength - yadda yadda yadda.

This bitch will pay, and so will Americans. I'm asking congress for 87 billion dollars to pay Halliburton. For what - I don't know, but we'll make the numbers add up.

Vote for Cob1639 - I'm right and you're wrong!

seven

09-04-2005, 02:37 AM

Cob > ummm... Katrina won... we weren't prepared... now after all this we will definately need even more vacation time! :cool: (It's still paid vacation, right??)

>>Flyboy<<

09-04-2005, 09:51 AM

OK Seven, now you're making sence, and we could sit here and discuss the budget cuts and FEMA and how the Federal Government re-aligned federal agencies that ultimetly led to the carnage suffered in New Orleans. Bottom line, there is a mis-understanding of how much the Federal Government is supposed to help it's citizens in Lieu of state and local government, and it seemed you missed that boat in your first post. FEMA and the Feds screwed up before, during Andrew, the 94 Northrige Earthquake (which I experienced) to name a few. It ain't perfect and it never will be - Government isn't perfect and it never will be and it doesn't matter if Clinton or Bush or Republicans or Democrats are at the helm. My main point was and still is 1.The Mayor and Govenor of Louisiana Rolyal screwed up, a lot more than the Feds, but they are no angels either. 2. The Mayor of NO had no evacuation plan (and probably never has an emergency services plan in place) and allowed his city to go into the state that it is in. You stated how poor New Orleans is and how there were many people who couldn't evacuate becuase of no transportation or lack of money, but when you see dozens of city buses under water, you got to ask yourself who's to blame there.

Those good people of New Orleans and Louisiana who are suffering need and deserve to be helped wheather they are black, white rich or poor, those looting and shooting at recuse helicopter need to die, end of story!!!!!

OH and about your brother - I honor him!!! At the same time my brother a 56 year old infantry man, 2 tour Viet Nam Vet who earned a Siver Star and Bronze Star with 3 clusters is on his way to Iraq as we speak. Not as withstanding, I served 8 years in the Naval Reseve as an aircraft mechanic. Your right to speak is the same as mine..........Even though I consider my self a moderate, some of your comments have the makings of a mis-guided and mis-informed liberal :rolleyes:

seven

09-04-2005, 12:38 PM

Just so you know... Maybe I might sound like a liberal on this issue but trust me, I can sound very conserative on other issues.

I have my own mind and I most definately like to keep it stimulated with information that can back my opinions. I try my best to analyze my opinion and not have it adopted by any group or party.

If I gave the impression that I am Anti-Republican based on my Republican Extremist comment, I would like to make a correction.

I don't care what party is in office, just as long there can be representation of some strong leadership.

I loved President Reagan (Truley the greatest communicater) and reconize the wonderful things he did durring his Administration, and believe that the first President Bush was excellent at securing our nation, initiating plans, and excuting them, making me feel protected and secure, without needing to promote fear to do so.

I also think President Clinton did some great things durring his Presidency and I was extremely disappointed on seeing his marital affairs being promoted on all the news channels. On Entertainment Tonight, I'd be all over it! But not on the channels where I'm trying to see what's going on with important issues.

My point.... I just want to state that my disappointment with this Administration has nothing to do with the party that he represents.

I love my country and I know that there is more opportunity here than anywhere else in the world. I myself tell people, you don't even need to be smart to succeed in America, all you need is motivation...

I am disappointed with this Administration because of their lack of communication with the people (we are the ones that pay him to do his job), and his actions that appear to me are not well planned or delivered.

I feel as "The People" it is our job to pay attention, always have debates so that we can continue finding solutions to problems so that we can continue being part of the Best Country we are so fortunate to live in.

We owe it to The Men who risked their lives or died for this Country to make sure no power will be abused and that our Government continue to SERVE and PROTECT US... THE PEOPLE.

I'm outie! :) SEE YA!

>>Flyboy<<

09-04-2005, 01:42 PM

I loved President Reagan (Truley the greatest communicater) and reconize the wonderful things he did durring his Administration, and believe that the first President Bush was excellent at securing our nation, initiating plans, and excuting them, making me feel protected and secure, without needing to promote fear to do so. AGREE!

you don't even need to be smart to succeed in America, all you need is motivation...

And now that New Orleans is going to pull out of this tragedy, that has to be the motive to those who need help and are willing to stand on their own rather to expect a handout for the rest of their lives!

See - it works better when you think before you write! :cool:

seven

09-04-2005, 10:12 PM

Everything I wrote in my first statements still apply....

Just because I gave props to Regan and the first Bush does not mean that I feel our current Administration need get their priorities straight....

I'm still angry that there wasn't better preparation on FEMA - which I mentioned is a Federal Government Agency and Bush's poor decision to appoint 2 of his college buddies Head of Diaster Management with absolutely no expierence.

My flaw in my first forum is not reconizing that The Louisana Governer and Mayor didn't do their job to make sure there was an earlier evcuation and the fact that FEMA (Ferderal) was incompetent because of having no expierence in how to handle diaster. That is the responsibility of our National Government. That was a very poor decision.

I do agree that people should start doing something about their circumstances but also stated that our Government is suppose to do what the people can not do. This is a situation clearly where Government should have done more. The Governer, The Mayor, and yes... our Administration.

I'm all for not handing out free rides for people because of what the wont't do but it is necessary to help them for what they can't do. It's clear that in this situation it is obvious that there was a lot that could not be done and that's where we should have stepped in.

I just wanted to clear up that I'm not Democrat, Republican, Independant, or Conservative.... There are excellent arguments for what all these parties stand for.

I am for the AMERICAN party... I don't feel that these victims who lost everything they have are trying to get a free ride, they truly need our help.

All parties should agree that these people should have been evacuted before the storm hit. The thousonds of people that obviously had no means to do it themselves.

From what I hear now, there are lots of car jackings and looting going on right here in Houston. Some would say (and I'm pretty confident you are one of them) that this confirms what a bunch of savages these people are.

I watched the news today as they went to visit the Louisana Dome. It reaked of human fecies, urin, and death (GROSS) with no food, water, or sleep to boot. These people were surrounded by this for days. There own waste and people dying all around them. I can't imagine what that's done to their since of reality and their perception of right and wrong.

So now, on top of people that were already crazy before this whole thing happened they are crazier, a whole bunch more are mentally insane after the fact, and our city is filling up with this unfortunate, but necessary for the sake of humanity to do what we can. They're homeless, angry, deranged and now a great danger to us! They're here, with no where to go and nothing to lose. We take the risk for the ones who we can help, I'm just pointing out the cost.

The cost did not have to be this bad. We need better leadership with better planning - which is exactly what is expected from them!

Was I wrong for blaming our political leaders? NO... I still stand by my accusation. I feel like I was in the wrong for not sharing the blame with the Governer and Mayor who are retarded for not doing, without question, was critical.

This isn't over yet, much of Louisana's problems have now become ours. I have 3 children and now I'm worry for my safety and theirs now that we are surrounded by people who have nothing to lose on top of the 5 or more days of crap they witnessed to make them more loco and dangerous!

And if that isn't enough to worry about, our hospitals are already filling up with people and children who have intestinial problems and I can't imagine what kind of disease stricken virus' they picked up waiting around this unimaginable enviroment.

So now we are taking big risks in filling up our schools with possibly some unknown viruses that we'll have to learn as we go and hope that they aren't contagious.

We have many things to be concerned about and unfortunately will not have answers if anything horrible is to occur from all this unless more horrible things happen first.

Much of this could have been prevented. They new it was going to happen and I'm still angry that they sat around acting clueless and pretend like they couldn't have seen any of it coming.

And as you have asked me too, I have addressed all the information based on undeniable facts why I am frusterated and outraged with the lack of responsibilty and attention given to this event that was not, by all means, a suprise attack. This is why I am extremely offended that they sit there acting dumb like there is no way they could have seen it coming.

The only difference in my opinion before I calmed down to think rationaly is not sharing the blame with the state.

I blame all postitions of authority. All of this could have and should have been prevented. There is extreme neglegence on this whole situation and nobody wants to take any responsibility for any of it.. "We couldn't have known." crap. That is a lye.

I just wanted to point out that I am not a cry baby Liberal, or a victim defending Democrat, which I feel you were orginally attacking me as.

I beg to differ, if anything I feel that my frusterations are quite Conservative. I feel that there was Responsiblity, which I feel is justified, that is expected of our Government and State and am outraged that they are lying to me saying they are doing the best they can and had no way of preparing for this diaster and are trying to dodge any of the responsibility that belongs to them.

This is exactly the attitudes that Conservatives will not tolerate!

Just had to make, yet another statement (I warned you about my yakitty yack!) because I couldn't help but notice that you only highlighted agreement with me on the two Republican Presidents I paid respects too as well as a statement I made that is known as a highly Republican view.

I KNEW IT! YOUR A REPUBLICAN! Just catch yourself from becoming an extremist! LOL ;)

Wallis

09-04-2005, 10:38 PM

I believe O'Reilly (the O'Reilly Factor) said it best: if you depend on the government for anything, be prepared for disappointment.

I am disappointed with many of the survivors, especially on the overpasses and stretches of highway around them. On another forum, one poster wrote was I was thinking the night before. (I was trying to figure out what I would be doing if I were among these people.) They did very little to help themselves. With all of the carnage around them, none scavanged to erect even a lean-to to shade people from the hot sun. There appeared to me no leadership found anywhere, even from those who were wearing a uniform. Hopefully, as time passes by, we will hear stories from these survivors that will describe the situation as different.

Another poster (same forum) reiterated what the government has stated since 911: everyone must be prepared to survive at least three days before being helped. We are seeing a classic example of the new American apathy all up and down the stricken areas: it won't happen to me. I did not start to get angry at our politicians until the fourth day, when it appeared to me that the local and state politicians were so paralyzed to the point of inaction, even to the point of not asking for federal assistance.

I remember the American spirit (and then seeing it wane through the Vietnam War) as being one of "we can take care of ourselves and our own." Now it appears that a growing number of people are sitting and waiting (and wailing) for someone else to help them. My heart and soul go out to all the Americans who are living up to that original American spirit that really makes our nation great, a well-spring that originates from all creeds, ethnic origins, and views of thought. They will be the unsung heroes in American history. At the same time, I try to keep my anger in check and lean towards sympathy (difficult at best) at those people who did not lift a finger to help themselves.

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong on this point, but other than times of war, this will be the first time the United States will accept help from other nations. Whenever other nations have had devastating problems, the United States was usually the first nation to respond. Not that accepting help from the outside is bad, it still speaks volumes as to the magnitude of this horrific disaster.

seven

09-04-2005, 10:56 PM

Hey Wallis!

There you are! How about our debate! I just wanted to note that I updated my last forum a little bit because I forgot to address our hospitals filling up with children with major intestenial problems and being concerned about our schools filling up with children that aren't aware and not knowing rather or not it might be contagious. Most intestenial viruses are extremely contagious.

I agree that people shouldn't be co-dependant on our government but I strongly believe the government should intervene for the masses of the people. We still have, especially as a resident of Houston, many worries and concerns ahead of us that could have been prevented or at the very least minimized which adds to my frusterations.

Whatever the views or disagreements, I'm happy that they are being discussed and the concerns are being addressed.

It's when people feel there is no point in addressing any issues because there is no hope in being heard or no point in trying to understand is when I really start getting scared. It is nice to know that not everyone's most important concerns of the day is watching to see who will actually eat what on Fear Factor!

seven

09-04-2005, 11:41 PM

With family history of Nurses and having 3 children of my own, I know all to well how contagious intestinal virus's are.

My youngest spent 7 days in the hospital at 2 years old after catching the Rotavirus in her daycare. Needless to say, my husband and I agreed for me to stay at home until she got much older to remove her from daycare being to sensetive, so young, when this virus hit her!

It was horrible! We were in a hospital room that had a sign with bright red letters: Caution: Very contagious... This sign was necessary because we were in the children's ward.

She had no appetite and had to where an IV to keep her hydrated so that she wouldn't die of dehydration.

It is a pretty common virus that spreads but when the kids are older or it spreads to an adult (the whole house got the virus), it's usually sick with lost of appetite, fever, diarrea, and vomiting for a day but because she was so young, it effected her much more severly.

We were strapped to that bed for seven days and she could not leave the room to go to the play room or anywhere for protection of the other children.

I could not leave her bed and had to go through a whole ordeal just to untangle her IV and push her IV holder into the bathroom with me carefully making sure the tube would pull or snag anywhere with that needle in her hand.

She was so scared of being left alone in that big strange place where these strange people stuck this huge needle in her hand (bringing her daddy into a river of tears) and trapped her hand between two boards to secure the needle from being taken out..

Should this fear become a reality to battle, I am confident that any virus we might be facing are going to be more severe than the one my little girl struggled with overcoming, just because of the conditions of which any new virus might have occured out of these death and waste filled enviroments.

This is a reasonable concern that is highly likely.

These are things I didn't think about until today with the news of the hospitals.

It made me realize that we probably have even more things not yet known that we may have to prepare ourselves for.

This has moved on further than New Orleans and getting emotional empathyzing with what they may be going through. Whatever else might develope from this whole mess! These problems are in my back yard.... NOW this has become a personal concern for my neighbors, my friends, and my family. :confused:

cob1639

09-05-2005, 01:25 AM

I have a few issues here Mr. Wallis. 1st of all there were some makeshift "shelters" built for the elderly and sick at the convention center before help arrived. You have to notice it for yourself though because the news won't mention it.

As of Friday, there was ONE INCIDENT of shots being fired at rescue helicoptors. ONE. Officials turned that ONE INCIDENT into an excuse for their poor response. I don't know who is to blame for the crappy response and I don't care, but they ALL jumped on the bandwagon of blaming that ONE INCIDENT. The news mentioned it so often that people think that all choppers were being shot at.

In another thread I compared media coverage to that of 9/11. All anybody ever talked about on 9/11 were heroes. Nobody in New Orleans is a hero, they're savages. That is another reason that people are complaining about racism.

I don't know if the news companies are racist, I don't know if the government is racist but something stinks. (And it's not the Superdome) It stinks even more when people just dismiss any argument of racism. Especially without even addressing these concerns.

Obviously - There was horrible behavior in the aftermath, no one is excusing that, but there's also horrible behavior from the government. Not just the incompetence, forget about that for a second, but people saying crap like, "They were warned to get out, it's their fault too." and EVERYBODY blaming everybody else. That is horrible behavior too. The media's failure to mention positive "triumphs" of the HUMAN spirit is horrible behavior too, in my opinion. I know they were out there because I saw some during the very pictures that they were ignoring. The Human spirit trumps the American spirit when your in their position.

You're right about relying too much on the gov't. That's a bad idea on so many levels. But during disasters like this, people need to trust their government. It helps give them hope that they otherwise wouldn't have. These people were failed by that gov't.

99.9% of the people who were stuck there acted right. The news actually DID talk about the people at the convention center who did what they were told to do by city officials. They acted right even after days and days. But whenever there's a lack of authority there will be that 0.01% of people who take advantage. IN ANY CITY.

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 10:06 AM

I KNEW IT! YOUR A REPUBLICAN! Just catch yourself from becoming an extremist! LOL ;)

AND YOU'RE WRONG - I'M INDEPENDENT!!!!

I have a few issues here Mr. Wallis. 1st of all there were some makeshift "shelters" built for the elderly and sick at the convention center before help arrived. You have to notice it for yourself though because the news won't mention it.

As of Friday, there was ONE INCIDENT of shots being fired at rescue helicoptors. ONE. Officials turned that ONE INCIDENT into an excuse for their poor response. I don't know who is to blame for the crappy response and I don't care, but they ALL jumped on the bandwagon of blaming that ONE INCIDENT. The news mentioned it so often that people think that all choppers were being shot at.

In another thread I compared media coverage to that of 9/11. All anybody ever talked about on 9/11 were heroes. Nobody in New Orleans is a hero, they're savages. That is another reason that people are complaining about racism.

I don't know if the news companies are racist, I don't know if the government is racist but something stinks. (And it's not the Superdome) It stinks even more when people just dismiss any argument of racism. Especially without even addressing these concerns.

Obviously - There was horrible behavior in the aftermath, no one is excusing that, but there's also horrible behavior from the government. Not just the incompetence, forget about that for a second, but people saying crap like, "They were warned to get out, it's their fault too." and EVERYBODY blaming everybody else. That is horrible behavior too. The media's failure to mention positive "triumphs" of the HUMAN spirit is horrible behavior too, in my opinion. I know they were out there because I saw some during the very pictures that they were ignoring. The Human spirit trumps the American spirit when your in their position.

You're right about relying too much on the gov't. That's a bad idea on so many levels. But during disasters like this, people need to trust their government. It helps give them hope that they otherwise wouldn't have. These people were failed by that gov't.

99.9% of the people who were stuck there acted right. The news actually DID talk about the people at the convention center who did what they were told to do by city officials. They acted right even after days and days. But whenever there's a lack of authority there will be that 0.01% of people who take advantage. IN ANY CITY.

Very True Cob - and yesterday 5 snipers were killed when they opened up on contractors attempting to make repairs to a bridge in New Orleans. The contractors were escorted by National Guard troops and killed the snipers - there's you're 1%!!!!

Soulja2Luv

09-05-2005, 10:22 AM

GOOD POINTS ALL AROUND!BUT facts R obvious!4 one thing if you had been stuck like that , would you get FOOD anyway possible , WAIT 4 BUSH , or DIE?OUT of the three 2 out of 3 leed 2 death and the 1 left leaves a 90 percent chance of getting sniped 4 looting!LOOKS like a FUCKED situation2 ME! QUESTIONS are left 2 debat! But out of FACTS do u see BUSH as a HERO or a ZERO after the way he took care of things.9 11 Katrina POOR america! ALL 3 victums of BUSH!
What could be changed 2 prevent disaster now that the GLOBE is warming and the storms will intencify?
How many more PRISONS will be created B4 NEW JOBS?
How many more KIDS will suffer and elderly die without media attention in EVERY city in AMERICA?
N someways i feal we still are N a stone AGE with tools of mass destruction N the hands of CHILDREN!

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 10:25 AM

Soulja2Luv

09-05-2005, 10:32 AM

FACTS 80 percent of the people escaped ! THE poor got left behind! AND blame the QUEEN NOT the worker ants!
AND YES BUSH IS A BITCH

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 10:38 AM

FACTS 80 percent of the people escaped ! THE poor got left behind! AND blame the QUEEN NOT the worker ants!
AND YES BUSH IS A BITCH
A Mayor and A Govenor worker ants? You're ignorant and uneducated, you sound like a fool!

By your responses you have no concept how the Government works or why the lapses in our government led up to this tragedy, do you read or just believe what you see on TV?!?!?!?

Soulja2Luv

09-05-2005, 11:06 AM

Any other names 2 call? MayB a THREAT or 2?
AMERICA needs HELP our government is far from perfect!And yes we have PUPPET leaders.

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 11:34 AM

Any other names 2 call? MayB a THREAT or 2?
AMERICA needs HELP our government is far from perfect!And yes we have PUPPET leaders.
no - no threats, I don't see you as a threat to me, It seems you're just a little overzealous and uneducated....

Puppet leaders?!? Who do yu mean, The Mayor of New Orleans? The Govenor of Lousisana?!?! The Presidnet?

seven

09-05-2005, 01:56 PM

Soulja2Luv has some opinions that I'm going to have to strongly agree with, and for the life of me, I just don't see how any of her opinons appear to be uneducated...

Those opinions can be based on the history of this administration... EASY....

You are sooooo not Independant... you are to quick to react with extreme hostility towards anyone new who speaks against the Bush Administration.

I haven't met one Independant that has been so defense in protecting their incompetence. I have a probably believing that you are the first one.

Not meaning to call you a lier but I just have a feeling you would rather be Independant than have me guess correctly!

(uh oh... I think he's gonna blow!!)

cob1639

09-05-2005, 06:19 PM

Very True Cob - and yesterday 5 snipers were killed when they opened up on contractors attempting to make repairs to a bridge in New Orleans. The contractors were escorted by National Guard troops and killed the snipers - there's you're 1%!!!!

Yeah, I saw that on the news. Those bastards are screwing up my argument!

Maybe if we're lucky they will send those guys to Houston!

O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 06:51 PM

Soulja2Luv has some opinions that I'm going to have to strongly agree with, and for the life of me, I just don't see how any of her opinons appear to be uneducated...
When four letter words are used in every other sentence, Iwould say she either has a lapse in vocabulary flow or maybe just writers lock! :confused:

You are sooooo not Independant... you are to quick to react with extreme hostility towards anyone new who speaks against the Bush Administration.

No, actually I have a problem seeing people making statements based on ignorance and half-thruths with a dose of CNN.......

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 06:55 PM

Yeah, I saw that on the news. Those bastards are screwing up my argument!

I wish they would stop so you could tell me I'm wrong :D

Maybe if we're lucky they will send those guys to Houston!

O+<

Maybe they're Radiers Fans :eek:

cob1639

09-05-2005, 07:48 PM

Soulja2Luv has some opinions that I'm going to have to strongly agree with, and for the life of me, I just don't see how any of her opinons appear to be uneducated...

Woah, Soulja is a chick? I really gotta start reading some of these replies before just assuming everybody is wrong but me! I almost missed out on the Soul mama!

Hey soulja, what's up baby? I saw some footage of a neighborhood in Nawlins with a bunch of run down houses. Of course, in a drive thru of a KFC there was a brand new Mercedes - untouched by water but water all around. Damn that's annoying. What a slap in the face to all the poor folks. Luck is a very important variable but you can't hold luck against somebody. But I can and will complain!

Katrina was a racist bitch.
O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 08:07 PM

Woah, Soulja is a chick? I really gotta start reading some of these replies before just assuming everybody is wrong but me! I almost missed out on the Soul mama!

Hey soulja, what's up baby? I saw some footage of a neighborhood in Nawlins with a bunch of run down houses. Of course, in a drive thru of a KFC there was a brand new Mercedes - untouched by water but water all around. Damn that's annoying. What a slap in the face to all the poor folks. Luck is a very important variable but you can't hold luck against somebody. But I can and will complain!

Katrina was a racist bitch.
O+<

.....LOL!.....

seven

09-05-2005, 10:05 PM

When four letter words are used in every other sentence, Iwould say she either has a lapse in vocabulary flow or maybe just writers lock! :confused:

Now I know you, Mr.Flyboy, are not accusing sombody of talking trashy? .... :rolleyes:

I wish they would stop so you could tell me I'm wrong :D
Maybe they're Radiers Fans :eek:

I don't know crap about sports... (Don't think I didn't get the joke)

Katrina is a racist bitch!

Oh there you go... showing out in front of your friends... You know Katrina was a racist b!tch... now stop pretending like you are uneducated!

Hey soulja, what's up baby? I saw some footage of a neighborhood in Nawlins with a bunch of run down houses. Of course, in a drive thru of a KFC there was a brand new Mercedes - untouched by water but water all around. Damn that's annoying. What a slap in the face to all the poor folks. Luck is a very important variable but you can't hold luck against somebody. But I can and will complain!

That was totally out of line, apology not accepted... Shit like that isn't funny unless your messing around with a friend... NOT COOL . You know that was OUT OF LINE.

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 10:46 PM

Now I know you, Mr.Flyboy, are not accusing sombody of talking trashy? .... :rolleyes: .

YEP - Go back and see how many times a used a four-letter word. It's one thing to tell someone when they're being an idiot, or pop off with the occasional profanity, it's another thing to use continual four letter words as filler, it shows void in one's writing ability as well as brain matter! :rolleyes:

Wallis

09-05-2005, 11:04 PM

There was another good story that was printed in a newspaper E-zine (Johnny White's (http://www.wwltv.com/local/stories/090405cckatrinajrfrenchquarter.26851646.html). These folks created what was dubbed a tribe of twelve. Apparently, the bartender is an ex-Air Force medic, and he kept twelve people safe and sound from both the elements and the bad guys.

I noticed, too, that on Fox News many people do not want to leave their homes. These people apparently feel that they can survive on what they have until "relief" comes in, meaning the building of the city and restoring power, et al.

cob1639

09-05-2005, 11:11 PM

That was totally out of line, apology not accepted... Shit like that isn't funny unless your messing around with a friend... NOT COOL . You know that was OUT OF LINE.

Waa, waa, waa!

Suddenly I'm starting to worry that the soulja is a dude. My record of defending homosexuals is preceeding me. My position is not a good one. I am so freggin screwed.

SOULJA BETTER BE A CHICK!!!

O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 11:13 PM

Waa, waa, waa!

Suddenly I'm starting to worry that the soulja is a dude. My record of defending homosexuals is preceeding me. My position is not a good one. I am so freggin screwed.

SOULJA BETTER BE A CHICK!!!

O+<

Yea! Seven may go off too..... :eek:

seven

09-05-2005, 11:46 PM

cob1639

09-05-2005, 11:48 PM

Does anyone else think that the National Weather Service bears some responsibility for the people who got stuck out?

Everytime there's the slightest swirl in the gulf:

EVACUATE! Forget your stuff just get the hell out as quick as you can! We're all gonna die - AAHHHH!!!!!

If you hear that crap 30 times a year it kinda loses its effect. You can't evacuate every time there a catagory 1 hurricane like they want you to. Especially if you're poor. Evacuating costs money.

Why won't someone just tell them to be more responsible regarding that crap. You'll NEVER hear them say, "This hurricane isn't really that bad".

Sometimes - hurricanes are not that bad, it won't hurt to say it!

O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 11:49 PM

Cob, I need you to come over and put some highlights in my hair. Can you stop and get some color samples??

WOE!!! THIS IS IN THE WRONG THREAD! :D :eek:

cob1639

09-05-2005, 11:53 PM

Cob, I need you to come over and put some highlights in my hair. Can you stop and get some color samples??

SHIT!!!

Soulja is a dude. I went back and read past posts for HIM and he's a dude.

Damn it.

I WAS MISLEAD!

O+<

>>Flyboy<<

09-05-2005, 11:56 PM

SHIT!!!

Soulja is a dude. I went back and read past posts for HIM and he's a dude.

Damn it.

I WAS MISLEAD!

O+<

I hope that doesn't leave an emotional scar! :(

Soulja2Luv

09-21-2005, 10:45 AM

cob1639

09-24-2005, 04:13 PM

Thats usualy what happins when sum1 just talks and dont no whats going on or what he or she is talking about lmao! Anywayz all name calling and insecurity 2 the side ! When will things change and kids grow up and be men not mice is the question!Every1 blames or has a excuse 4 something when the real issue seems 2 be over looked typical things from imature people ! YO momma this yo momma that B4 you no it your not just bored your head is fat! And the RAIDERS are number 1 no fair wheather FAN here no pun intended . LMAO

A few things Soulja:

1. I never said or even implied that I know what I'm talking about...EVER!

2. What the heck is LMAO?

3. The Raiders suck! This coming from a Texans fan whose team has played the worst 2 games in NFL history. 0 & 2 and getting worse.

Wallis

09-24-2005, 10:50 PM

Laughing My Ass Off.

Sorry, guys. Ever since the Raiders "defected" to Los Angeles, they will never receive the kind of adoration I had for them in Oakland.

Now, if we could just make LA into an island, send it off a thousand miles, and sink it!

>>Flyboy<<

09-24-2005, 11:18 PM

cob1639

09-25-2005, 02:49 AM

GOD BLESS JIM PLUNKETT! :cool:

Jim Plunkett?? Super Bowl XV against the heavily favored Eagles? That was the first Super Bowl I ever saw. I was hooked. The Oilers got put out of the 1st round. I cried but I was only 7 so piss off!

Wallis - still bitter about the move to LA......Rumor has it that a quake will take care of both of your requests in one shot. I guess it pays to have the man upstairs as a close personal friend! Could I ask you to pray for the Texans?

Laughing My Ass Off. I would have never figured that out. I guess I'm not too bright!

Wallis

09-25-2005, 05:50 AM

>>Flyboy<<

09-25-2005, 07:52 AM

I never lived in LA, being a Northern Californian. I did live in Redlands, which is about 2,000 feet above sea level and just a little southwest of San Bernadino. Thus, we "northerners" had a real healthy rivalry against those "southerners."

I will feel real bad should an earthquake level LA because of all the people who live there. But I wouldn't feel all that bad if the blasted city disappeared. :D

I lived in LA and 60 miles to the north. 2 1/2 years ago we packed up and got the hell out. There was no love loss when I saw that "Welcome to California" sign in my rear view mirrior....

When I first lived in LA in the 70s it was real nice. It seems by 1980 it got over-run with every freak, kook, actor-wanna be, gold digger, grave digger and nose picker! I left in 83 and returned in 1990 and purposely moved away from LA. I have to visit on occasion, I hate it!

*_NordiC_RootS_*

09-25-2005, 08:23 PM

Its called lack of social programs,or should i say lack of compassion!Every major city is like or almost like LA . Its called Capitalism we the people let it happen so BIG BROTHER takes another mile screw the inch and wants more.Soon propaganda will be commen and new laws will efectively take more rights and manipulate them to less freedom!Hell people have to murder to get better educations now and some of the sheeple thinks its better then ever.America is so perfect they would say when actualy we have a long way to go yet!

>>Flyboy<<

09-25-2005, 11:36 PM

*_NordiC_RootS_*

09-26-2005, 12:36 AM

Soulja2Luv

09-26-2005, 01:53 AM

I think i am going 2 take a second 2 LMAO! :D

cob1639

09-26-2005, 01:55 AM

Hell no im not a socialist im a humanist PEOPLE first morons like you last!Stuped people should get the chair,Take a seat KING of the ignorant!Leed the rest of the sheeple to the fate they deserve tell that big brother says it wont hurt!

Help the poor and you're a socialist.
Question the government and you're unpatriotic.

These are good things to do. These are things that Jesus would do! Jesus must be an unpatriotic socialist. These days he wouldn't be crucified - he'd be given lethal injection!

Soulja2Luv

09-26-2005, 02:03 AM

So it seems unfortunatly! Have a ideal or way of doind things that are seen as diffrent or threatining get murderd how civilized! RERUN of the romans and catholic church!INQUASITION ANY 1 its been awhile since we had supression and murder on a large scale ! 4 a just cause of a spoiled leader that feals threatend he might lose control ut oh god 4 bid that no 1 can have a idea let alone a way of life diffrent then the JUST 1 ! ITS makes chooseing the better of any evils seem retarded why choose evil in the first place? :confused:

>>Flyboy<<

09-26-2005, 09:12 AM

Hell no im not a socialist im a humanist PEOPLE first morons like you last!Stuped people should get the chair,Take a seat KING of the ignorant!Leed the rest of the sheeple to the fate they deserve tell that big brother says it wont hurt!

And you have showed that you make statements without utilizing the full capacity of your brain. A humanist you say? From your what you written so far I think you may be sub-human. You've made statements that suppot no rhyme or reason, perhaps you shouldn't type stoned!!!!

>>Flyboy<<

09-26-2005, 09:20 AM

I think i am going 2 take a second 2 LMAO! :D
Don't hurt yourself :rolleyes:

Help the poor and you're a socialist.
Question the government and you're unpatriotic.

These are good things to do. These are things that Jesus would do! Jesus must be an unpatriotic socialist. These days he wouldn't be crucified - he'd be given lethal injection!
And I never said anything bad about socialists or those who oppose government. Bernard Sanders was a Congressman from VT. for years, and open Socialist. I have all the respect for him in the world because he openly showed what he stood for. It's when you have people preach the evils of capitialism but yet offer no other alternatives and yet they support themselves in this economic system is what pisses me off! It's one thing to not support your government, it's one thing to be a socialist - it's another thing to be a hyptocrite!

cob1639

09-26-2005, 01:11 PM

And I never said anything bad about socialists or those who oppose government. Bernard Sanders was a Congressman from VT. for years, and open Socialist. I have all the respect for him in the world because he openly showed what he stood for. It's when you have people preach the evils of capitialism but yet offer no other alternatives and yet they support themselves in this economic system is what pisses me off! It's one thing to not support your government, it's one thing to be a socialist - it's another thing to be a hyptocrite!

Plus I think Bernard Sanders rushed for over 2000 yards in 1997!

My point was that Karl Rove is better at his job than anyone ever. Those statements are rediculous but the people believe that they are appropriate because Rove is just that good. People like Rush Limbaugh take it a bit too far when he says helping the poor is unamerican and actually Communist.

Republicans and democrats are like Yankees and Red Sox fans. You try to talk a Red Sox fan into routing for the Yankees. It can't be done. Karl Rove probably could though!

>>Flyboy<<

09-26-2005, 05:26 PM

Plus I think Bernard Sanders rushed for over 2000 yards in 1997!
LOL!!!! If he did he has a Che Guerra sticker on the side of his helmet... :p

My point was that Karl Rove is better at his job than anyone ever. Those statements are rediculous but the people believe that they are appropriate because Rove is just that good. People like Rush Limbaugh take it a bit too far when he says helping the poor is unamerican and actually Communist.
It's one thing to help the poor, it's another thing to set up a welfare state like what happened in the UK in the 1960s. The far right is deathly scared of this. We need a system that will truly help those in need and provide them with the tools to raise themselves out of poverty, providing they want the help. Those who remain stagnant attempting to live off the fat of the land are the ones to be targeted...

Republicans and democrats are like Yankees and Red Sox fans. You try to talk a Red Sox fan into routing for the Yankees. It can't be done. Karl Rove probably could though!

Good point! But I don't think he could convince a Yankee fan to root for the Red Sox, especially when it's going to take the Red Sox about 400 years to catch up to the Yankees in World Series Championships!

Wallis

09-26-2005, 07:41 PM

The government should not be in the business of "taking care of people."

The people should not be looking for a government that is going to "take care of them."

The government was designed to protect people, essentially from themselves. There is nothing wrong with capitalism. Abuses and excesses of any system will flourish if allowed.

The people have the resources to "take care of themselves." But do they have the will? Our forefathers did not run to the government every time they were in "need." Today, we have a tendency to run to the government whenever we have a hangnail!

The people have the power to get things done, as we are seeing with tremendous efforts being accomplished by non-government agencies and big business. Why we want government with all of its pork and corruption to "take care of us" is beyond reason and logic.

Here's a news flash: Congress is unwilling, for example, to slash pork from the highway bill (beautification projects in states unaffected by the two hurricanes) and use that money to rebuild the devastated areas of the South. This is an example of how government "takes care of the people."

------

By the way, Nordic, the use of language is a direct reflection on the use--repeat, use--of one's intelligence. The use of "slash and burn" is not--repeat, not--a recommended form of debate nor an effective means of convincing anyone to your point of view.

Soulja2Luv

09-26-2005, 08:10 PM

The people have the resources to "take care of themselves." But do they have the will? Our forefathers did not run to the government every time they were in "need." Today, we have a tendency to run to the government whenever we have a hangnail!
WALLICE
Our fourfathers had a revolution to end what we have today the funny thing is we have no new land of dreams!Or real men to lead another revolution they have effective ways of keeping us all stuck with no way to change it!
And if a man wanted to live off the land and not be a part of the EVIL EMPIRE that to is impossible you get trespassing charges or jailed for trapping game to eat effectively we have no power anymore or a way to live the way one person may see fit its a there way or no way {WAY OF LIFE}AND never use our 4 fathers as sheeple they were real men unlike U obviously!
Also the government is not in the business of taking care of people the impoverish the masses for a minority few its modern day slavery!
And people should look for a government that conceders all not just the 15 percent of the RICH.
The government kills people not protect people!
I think if you made 150 dollars a week @ your job and had to pay 300 a week to survive you might have diffrent sheeple views on poverty!
And for some reason i think every1 has a opinion and calling names definatly dont make one person s idea better than another Nfact name callers have less credibility ANGER management may be needed! Look deep inside and find why childeish reflexes come out b4 logical reasoning.

Wallis

09-26-2005, 08:36 PM

Soul, please: it's Wallis. It's the only thing I can really call my own, and it gets abused so much! :o

Soulja2Luv

09-26-2005, 08:43 PM

Wallis

09-26-2005, 08:52 PM

Soul, you have valid points.

However, and I've been "there" and "done that," as I keep rebuilding my life from scratch about every ten years or so, everyone has the ability to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and get their life back together. I believe you gave us an excellent success story for yourself.

If it costs $300 to live on a $150 income, then a change needs to happen. Perhaps this is the "good" that will happen out of this hurricane disaster. People who otherwise could not "get out" are being given a new lease on life, a chance to rebuild.

I was referring more to the spirit of our forefathers. O'Reilly on the Factor stated it rather eloquently, I think: "If you depend on the government, be prepared to be disappointed." Another quip phrase, if you will, is an endorsement of "the world owes me a living." Too often, in America and in Britain, the citizens turn to the government to give them that "living" they think they are due. "I voted for you; aren't you supposed to bend over and kiss my ass?" (from GhostBusters)

I believe, too, that we need to start moving away from harboring all of these angers that we have inherited from our "fathers." The Koreans have a great word for it: "han." It is untranslateable from a word-for-word standpoint. But the "han" meaning is the continuance of pain, hurt, anger, and the like that has been passed down from generation to generation. In one case, a young man felt obligated to have a "han" against the Japanese because his grandmother developed a "han" against the Japanese during their occupation (1910-1945). We Americans still harbor "hans" that we just don't want to trash. It is my opinion that these "hans" are stumbling blocks for people who say they want to rise up from their state of misery (very subjective, if you catch my drift) but won't because they believe they can't. (As I taught my children, once you allow the word "can't" into our vocabulary or brain, then you "can't" accomplish anything.)

With all of our faults as a nation, I still firmly believe that the environment fostered by our nation allows for all the "cans" people want to try to achieve. But government is not the panacea for fulfilling those "cans." There are government programs that will give head-starts and protection, but it still comes down to the individual to work his "ass" off to accompish his goals. I believe you would agree on this point: a real man is not afraid to work down to the nubbins to improve his lot.

You wrote that the government kills people. Aside from anti-social people who need killing, could you expound on how the government kills people?

>>Flyboy<<

09-26-2005, 09:02 PM

The people have the resources to "take care of themselves." But do they have the will? Our forefathers did not run to the government every time they were in "need." Today, we have a tendency to run to the government whenever we have a hangnail!.
Soulja, my hat's off to you! :cool:

Also the government is not in the business of taking care of people the impoverish the masses for a minority few its modern day slavery!
And people should look for a government that conceders all not just the 15 percent of the RICH.
The government kills people not protect people!
I think if you made 150 dollars a week @ your job and had to pay 300 a week to survive you might have diffrent sheeple views on poverty!

First show us how you think the government is taking of 15 percent of the "rich", and with that, what is you're defination of rich? 75,000 a year? 250,000 a year? 1 million a year? Are pro athletes included? Second if you're making $150.00 a week, that's under minimun wage, who's employing you? Third, in this day if you're only making $300.00 a week you better ask yourself..

1. Why am I only making $300.00 a week?
2. What do I have to do (leagally) to make more?
3. Do I have the motivation to do better?

And for some reason i think every1 has a opinion and calling names definatly dont make one person s idea better than another Nfact name callers have less credibility ANGER management may be needed! Look deep inside and find why childeish reflexes come out b4 logical reasoning.

You sound like you seen a counselor :rolleyes:

The government should not be in the business of "taking care of people."

The people should not be looking for a government that is going to "take care of them."

The government was designed to protect people, essentially from themselves. There is nothing wrong with capitalism. Abuses and excesses of any system will flourish if allowed.

The people have the resources to "take care of themselves." But do they have the will? Our forefathers did not run to the government every time they were in "need." Today, we have a tendency to run to the government whenever we have a hangnail!

The people have the power to get things done, as we are seeing with tremendous efforts being accomplished by non-government agencies and big business. Why we want government with all of its pork and corruption to "take care of us" is beyond reason and logic.

Here's a news flash: Congress is unwilling, for example, to slash pork from the highway bill (beautification projects in states unaffected by the two hurricanes) and use that money to rebuild the devastated areas of the South. This is an example of how government "takes care of the people."

------

By the way, Nordic, the use of language is a direct reflection on the use--repeat, use--of one's intelligence. The use of "slash and burn" is not--repeat, not--a recommended form of debate nor an effective means of convincing anyone to your point of view.

Great stuff Wallis, you hit the nail on the head and thank you for your comment about Nordick! You're alot more polite than I am, I just would of called him a jerkoff! :cool:

Wallis

09-26-2005, 09:34 PM

>>Flyboy<<

09-26-2005, 09:48 PM

Flyboy, I've often been accused that I cannot lower myself down to certain levels of language and intelligence. It's not that I cannot but more of a refusal on my part. Then again, why should I when you are much more articulate than I in these areas?

My hat's off to you. :D

I will take that as a complement! I try to truly maintain a level of intellectual dialogue, show examples of my beliefs and try to respect those tho I disagree with or visa versa, but sometimes there are some that, well, are go damn stupid, they just need to be bitchslapped! :rolleyes:

Wallis

09-26-2005, 09:51 PM

Right on!

(I just received an error that said my message was too short, so I have to add this addendum.)

cob1639

09-26-2005, 11:53 PM

Here's a news flash: Congress is unwilling, for example, to slash pork from the highway bill (beautification projects in states unaffected by the two hurricanes) and use that money to rebuild the devastated areas of the South. This is an example of how government "takes care of the people."

I hadn't heard that, Wallis but now I'm pissed. Actually more let down.

I agree with you and the FlyMan when you say stuff like "people should take care of themselves." My wife and I work our butts off to take care of our family with no financial help from the gov't but we used to get gov't insurance help before we could afford it for the kids.

I don't think that makes us welfare queens. We were using the gov't to help us get by until we could do it ourselves. I think the vast majority of welfare recipiants are just like we were but there seems to be a huge focus on the few who don't have any intent to ever get off the help.

There's was far less focus on the Enron style CEOs, for instance, who were costing the government and their investors mllions of dollars. That focus was instead directed at the poor black women who were getting away with an extra $100 each month. It just seems that the priorities are a little out of whack.

To me it's the same as in New Orleans. 99% of the people left behind were not looting but the focus is on the 1% who were. It gives the rest of the public the chance to say that New Orleans almost deserved to be forsaken since they're savages anyway.

Wallis

09-27-2005, 12:20 AM

Amen, Cob. Amen.

Soulja2Luv

09-27-2005, 01:07 AM

>>Flyboy<<

09-27-2005, 04:49 AM

Wallis im not mad at you ! I just dont want you to stoop to name calling like FLY! Your way to intelligent for that !
Sure i could be calling fly a uncle tom or worse but thats silly kid games and no one benefits from it! :)

Uncle Tom - Ha! You could do better than that, besides I just point out your stupidy when you say utterly dumb things, but lately you've been doing better! :rolleyes:

I truely think the failior to communicate we have is indickative of what our people in power seem to have aswell! We need to as a people put personal or affiliation based disagreements to the side and work together as 1 united!And when we can put silly things to the side and concentrate on problems with unbious veiws then problems can be solved.Who cares if 1 person thinks 1 way and another thinks a diffrent way the problem is still there!As people we can grow together and fix problems as a united people we can make changes devided they get worse or ignored alltogether!We can all pitch in not pitch out and nothing ever comes from degradeing or putting the blame on others, just more confusion and problems come from ununited thoughts!

NOW THAT'S VERY COOL! :)

Soulja2Luv

09-27-2005, 08:17 AM

Soulja2Luv

09-27-2005, 01:09 PM

The good men may do separately is small compared with what they may do collectively.
Benjamin Franklin :cool:

cob1639

09-27-2005, 02:34 PM

I truely think the failior to communicate we have is indickative of what our people in power seem to have aswell! We need to as a people put personal or affiliation based disagreements to the side and work together as 1 united!And when we can put silly things to the side and concentrate on problems with unbious veiws then problems can be solved.Who cares if 1 person thinks 1 way and another thinks a diffrent way the problem is still there!As people we can grow together and fix problems as a united people we can make changes devided they get worse or ignored alltogether!We can all pitch in not pitch out and nothing ever comes from degradeing or putting the blame on others, just more confusion and problems come from ununited thoughts!

That sounds good, but unfortunately we don't live in that world. You can easily get 600 (ish) congresspeople to agree that there's a problem, but once they start discussing how to solve it - the whole system falls apart. Their differences become the focus and the problem gets forgotten about. At least until something happens which shoves the problem in your face.

Example - The levee's in Nawlins. Everyone agreed there was a problem.

>>Flyboy<<

09-27-2005, 08:01 PM

You got me stumped here fly your killin me with kindness!
But i like what i see even though its shocking keep up the good work! I think you found that honey attracts more than salt never the less progress is a gr8 thing!I am proud of you. :)

The feeling is mutual, in my case I'll take beer in lieu of honey ;)

But Soulja - I give you grief only when you come it with hipshot statement and nothing to back it up with. Lately, you show at least an argument for your statement - I may not agree with you but i respect you more for it....

Now where the hell is that pinhead Nordic?!?! :mad:

Wallis

10-07-2005, 09:17 PM

In another forum, one poster, who is in the National Guard and was physically participating in New Orleans and elswhere, posted the below post. For your perusal:

LOUISIANA vs. TEXAS: 2 STATES, 22 OBSERVATIONS

1. Texas: Productive industrious state run by Republicans.
Louisiana: Government dependent welfare state run by Democrats.

2. Texas: Residents take responsibility to protect and evacuate themselves.
Louisiana: Residents wait for government to protect and evacuate them.

3. Texas: Local and state officials take responsibility for protecting their
citizens and property.
Louisiana: Local and state officials blame federal government for not
protecting their citizens and property.

4. Texas: Command and control remains in place to preserve order.
Louisiana: Command and control collapses allowing lawlessness.

5. Texas: Law enforcement officers remain on duty to protect city.
Louisiana: Law enforcement officers desert their posts to protect
themselves.

6. Texas: Local police watch for looting.
Louisiana: Local police participate in looting.

7. Texas: Law and order remains in control, 8 looters tried it, 8 looters
arrested.
Louisiana: Anarchy and lawlessness breaks out, looters take over city, no
arrests, criminals with guns have to be shot by federal troops.

8. Texas: Considerable damage caused by hurricane.
Louisiana: Considerable damage caused by looters.

9. Texas: Flood barriers hold preventing cities from flooding.
Louisiana: Flood barriers fail due to lack of maintenance allowing city to
flood.

10. Texas: Orderly evacuation away from threatened areas, few remain.
Louisiana: 25,000 fail to evacuate, are relocated to another flooded area.

11. Texas: Citizens evacuate with personal 3 day supply of food and water.
Louisiana: Citizens fail to evacuate with 3 day supply of food and water, do
without it for the next 4 days.

12. Texas: FEMA brings in tons of food and water for evacuees. State
officials provide accessible distribution points.
Louisiana: FEMA brings in tons of food and water for evacuees. State
officials prevent citizens from reaching distribution points and vice versa.

13. Louisiana: Media focuses on poor blacks in need of assistance, blames
Bush.
Texas: Media can't find poor blacks in need of assistance, looking for
something else to blame on Bush.

14. Texas: Coastal cities suffer some infrastructure damage, Mayors tell
residents to stay away until ready for repopulation, no interference from
federal officials.
Louisiana: New Orleans is destroyed, Mayor asks residents to return home as
another hurricane approaches, has to be overruled by federal officials.

15. Louisiana: Over 400 killed by storm, flooding and crime.
Texas: 24 killed in bus accident on highway during evacuation, no storm
related deaths.

16. Texas: Jailed prisoners are relocated to other detention facilities
outside the storm area.
& nbsp;
Louisiana: Jailed prisoners are set free to prey on city shops, residents,
and homes.

17. Texas: Local and state officials work with FEMA and Red Cross in
recovery operations.
Louisiana: Local and state officials obstruct FEMA and Red Cross from aiding
in recovery operations.

18. Texas: Local and state officials demonstrate leadership in managing
disaster areas.
Louisiana: Local and state officials fail to demonstrate leadership, require
federal government to manage disaster areas.

19. Texas: Fuel deliveries can't keep up with demand, some run out of gas on
highway, need help from fuel tankers before storm arrives.
Louisiana: Motorists wait till storm hits and electrical power fails.
Cars run out of gas at gas stations that can't pump gas. Gas in underground
tanks mixes with flood waters.

20. Texas: Mayors move citizens out of danger.
Louisiana: Mayor moves himself and family to Dallas.

21. Texas: Mayors continue public service announcements and updates on
television with Governor's backing and support.
Louisiana: Mayor cusses, governor cries, senator threatens president with
violence on television, none of them have a clue what went wrong or Ýwho's
responsible.

22. Louisiana: Democratic Senator says FEMA was slow in responding to
911 calls from Louisiana citizens.
Texas: Republican Senator says "when you call 911, the phone doesn't ring in
Washington, it rings here at the local responders".

What if state and local elected officials were forced to depend on
themselves and their own resources instead of calling for help from the
federal government? Texas cities would be back up and running in a few days.
Louisiana cities would still be under water next month.
Republicans call for action, Democrats call for help.

What party's candidates will you be voting for in our next election?

>>Flyboy<<

10-07-2005, 11:12 PM

Tuesday, August 23:
5:00 PM EDT: National Hurricane Center announcement: "Data from an Air Force reserve unit reconnaissance aircraft...along with observations from the Bahamas and nearby ships...indicate the broad low pressure area over the southeastern Bahamas has become organized enough to be classified as tropical depression twelve."

Friday, August 26:
11:30 AM EDT: Katrina is upgraded to a Category 2 hurricane. 5:00 PM EDT: The National Hurricane Center issues an advisory forecasting that Katrina would soon be a Category 3 hurricane.
5:00 PM CDT: Louisiana Governor Kathleen Babineaux Blanco declares a state of emergency for Louisiana (see public document). Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour declares a state of emergency for Mississippi (see public document).

Saturday, August 27:
President Bush officially declares that a "state of emergency"
exists in Louisiana and orders Federal aid to the affected areas
to complement state and local relief efforts.
4:00 pm CDT: Per Governor Blanco's order, Contraflow begins ,
reversing all traffic on inbound interstate lanes and making more
room for evacuating vehicles in outbound lanes.
5:00 PM CDT: New Orleans Mayor C. Ray Nagin declares a State of Emergency and issues a voluntary evacuation order, saying he is having his legal team determine if he can order a mandatory evacuation without exposing the city to legal liability for the closure of hotels and other businesses.

"exposing the city to legal liability"
SPOKEN LIKE A TRUE POLITICIAN!!!!!

8:00 PM EDT: National Hurricane Center Director Max Mayfield
briefs Louisiana Gov. Blanco, New Orleans Mayor Nagin and
Mississippi Gov. Barbour on Katrina's status. (SRC=TPM reporting)
11:00 PM EDT: The National Hurricane Center issues a warning
suggesting that Katrina is moving in a western direction in an
area that includes New Orleans.
Sunday, August 28:

1:00 AM CDT: Katrina is declared a Category 4 storm.
8:00 AM EDT: Katrina is declared a Category 5 storm, the highest
possible rating.
Approx. 10:00 AM CDT: New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin orders mandatory evacuations of New Orleans.

I GUESS A CAT 5 HURRICANE IS MIGHTER THAN LAWSUITS!!!!

Approx. 12:00 PM EDT: National Hurricane Center Director Max
Mayfield personally briefs President Bush as part of regular FEMA
briefing. (SRC=TPM reporting)
Louisiana Governor Blanco sends letter to President Bush
requesting various federal aid.
President Bush declares a state of emergency for both Mississippi
and Alabama, and declared Florida a federal disaster area in light
of damage done by Hurricane Katrina.
Afternoon: Director of the National Weather Service National
Hurricane Center (NHC), Max Mayfield, personally briefs President
Bush about Katrina by videoconference.
According to the AP, New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson offers
Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco help from his state's National
Guard. Blanco accepts, but paperwork needed to get the troops en
route doesn't come from Washington until late Thursday , Sep 2.

Tuesday, August 30:

Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco says everyone still in New Orleans an estimated 50,000 to 100,000 people must be evacuated. Crowds swell at the Superdome and the New Orleans convention center.

Approx. 3:30 PM CDT: At press conference with Sen. Landrieu, Gov.Blanco and others, Sen. David Vitter tells press: "In the metropolitan area in general, in the huge majority of areas, it's not rising at all. It's the same or it may be lowering slightly. In some parts of New Orleans, because of the 17th Street breach, it may be rising and that seemed to be the case in parts of
downtown. I don't want to alarm everybody that, you know, New Orleans is filling up like a bowl. That's just not happening."

WHAT A FRIGGIN JOKE!

Wednesday, August 31:

Governor Kathleen Blanco of Louisiana orders that all of New Orleans, including the Superdome, be evacuated. An exodus from the Superdome begins, with the first buses leaving for Houston's Astrodome, 350 miles away.
New Orleans 's 1,500 member police force is ordered to abandon search and rescue missions and turn their attention toward controlling the widespread looting and a curfew is placed in effect. Mayor Ray Nagin calls for increased federal assistance - I GUESS HE'S SEEN THE LIGHT!!!!!

Friday, September 2:

Louisiana Gov. Blanco issues second order authorizing the
commandeering and use of buses for evacuation and relief efforts;
order of August 31st rescinded (see public document).
Louisiana Gov. Blanco issues public health emergency order
temporarily suspending state medical licensing regulations, allow
licensed out-of-state medical professionals to work in the relief
and recovery effort (see public document).
President Bush tours Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana to survey
Katrina's damage. He describes the result of relief efforts up to
that point as "not acceptable."

The Bush administration asks Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco to request a federal takeover of relief efforts. The move would have given the federal government control over Louisiana's National Guard and local police. The state eventually rejected the proposal.

Saturday, September 3:
Governor Kathleen Blanco (D-La) hires James Lee Witt, FEMA director under President Clinton, to advise her during the relief effort. :eek:

WHAT A GREAT GOVERNOR! SHE DIDN'T WANT THE NATIONAL GUARD TO BE FEDERALIZED AND WASHINGTON TO TAKE OVER THE RELIEF EFFORT, BUT SHE HIRES A FORMER FEMA DIRECTOR!!!!

The Federal Government isn't blameless during Katrina, but by their own words and actions I think the elected officials of New Orleans and Louisiana showed their inability to deal with this disaster........

cob1639

10-07-2005, 11:35 PM

I just have to correct a few things here since I there's a lot of bullshit here...

1. Texas: Productive industrious state run by Republicans.
Louisiana: Government dependent welfare state run by Democrats.

Do you really think on party is better than the other? I thought better of you Wallis!

5. Texas: Law enforcement officers remain on duty to protect city.
Louisiana: Law enforcement officers desert their posts to protect
themselves.

There's an Investigation of the Houston Police Officers who no-showed during the overblown evacuation. So this part is just plain bullshit.

7. Texas: Law and order remains in control, 8 looters tried it, 8 looters
arrested.
Louisiana: Anarchy and lawlessness breaks out, looters take over city, no
arrests, criminals with guns have to be shot by federal troops.

Sorry Wallis - That's just not true. There were 16 incidents of looting in Texas. 8 were caught in one incident at a Wal Mart. Whoever quoted this got their facts confused, either by mistake or on purpose - either way, it makes their other facts questionable.

11. Texas: Citizens evacuate with personal 3 day supply of food and water.
Louisiana: Citizens fail to evacuate with 3 day supply of food and water, do
without it for the next 4 days.

Michael Brown said he never heard that there were people at the convention center. It was on ALL the news channels ALL day. I knew before he did - come on Wallis, I'm a complete idiot and I knew this before he did.

15. Louisiana: Over 400 killed by storm, flooding and crime.
Texas: 24 killed in bus accident on highway during evacuation, no storm
related deaths.

Shall we go into why that bus exploded? You're beloved Texas republican government allowed that company to keep operating even though their buses weren't passing their state inspections. That is how rediculous these partisan arguments are.

18. Texas: Local and state officials demonstrate leadership in managing
disaster areas.
Louisiana: Local and state officials fail to demonstrate leadership, require
federal government to manage disaster areas.

Katrina hit first. Do you really think if it were the other way around that Texas republicans would have been any better in in crisis mode? Rita hit the small towns in the sticks. You can't compare a big city disaster to a bunch of small towns. It's apples to oranges.

19. Texas: Fuel deliveries can't keep up with demand, some run out of gas on
highway, need help from fuel tankers before storm arrives.
Louisiana: Motorists wait till storm hits and electrical power fails.
Cars run out of gas at gas stations that can't pump gas. Gas in underground
tanks mixes with flood waters.

Great. The whole freggin city was evacuated for a direct miss. Kind of a waste or resources to me. 31 hours to get to Dallas. That's a 3 hour drive! I stayed home and couldn't get a tank of gas for me! I'm far more important than the rest of those idiots.

What if state and local elected officials were forced to depend on
themselves and their own resources instead of calling for help from the
federal government? Texas cities would be back up and running in a few days.
Louisiana cities would still be under water next month.
Republicans call for action, Democrats call for help.

What party's candidates will you be voting for in our next election?

ARE YOU FREGGIN KIDDING ME? You're comparing two different disasters. One hit a big city, below sea level, and one hit small towns. I've never heard of Pt. Arthur and I've lived in Houston all my life. This post is full of misrepresentations of the facts, plus - I think lessons were learned from Katrina that were applied to Rita. If you can't see that then you're a freggin idiot. Sorry to offend but this is the most rediculous thing I've ever read. If my brother gets some psycho chick pregnant - I'll know to wear a condom next time I screw some chick!

I'm gonna give Wallis the benifit of the doubt and consider this post was a meant as a joke. Wallis is better than this.

Soulja2Luv

10-08-2005, 01:14 AM

Not republican! They fail to be truthful and talk solution riddles that never get done. :D

cob1639

10-08-2005, 01:35 AM

The Federal Government isn't blameless during Katrina, but by their own words and actions I think the elected officials of New Orleans and Louisiana showed their inability to deal with this disaster........

You'll NEVER hear me defend that stupid Blanco bitch. She was making deals with the feds so that she could be in charge of the whole thing - thus taking credit for the response - during the time the people were hungry. Well, that bitch needs some blame for the crappy pesponse. But Clinton at least put a QUALIFIED person in charge, not some stupid horse judge, who was a friend of a friend whom he owed a favor. I haven't heard a decent republican response to that FACT yet!

I do freggin LOVE the Osama Bin Nagin reference. That is not very appropriate but DAMN IT'S FUNNY!!!

Wallis

10-08-2005, 02:09 AM

Don't shoot the messenger, Cob. I was just quoting another poster on another forum.

Did enjoy all the comments it attracted. I might just use them--with your permission--in the other forum.

cob1639

10-08-2005, 02:34 AM

Don't shoot the messenger, Cob. I was just quoting another poster on another forum.

Did enjoy all the comments it attracted. I might just use them--with your permission--in the other forum.

Please do - I usually have a pretty good bullshit detector but I have been swayed by the passionate with similar views! I was even persuaded by Farenheit 911 for the first couple of days after it came out!

I wish I didn't have to think for myself - it's such a hassle!

>>Flyboy<<

10-08-2005, 09:56 AM

Please do - I usually have a pretty good bullshit detector but I have been swayed by the passionate with similar views! I was even persuaded by Farenheit 911 for the first couple of days after it came out!

I wish I didn't have to think for myself - it's such a hassle!

Now Cob,I hope you're joking there! If you had a good bullshit detector the needle should of been pointing left if you were watching that movie!!! Michael Moore is an idiot and I would give him credibility if 10% of that movie made sense, but it didn't. His next documentary should be about Las Vegas buffet lines!!!

cob1639

10-08-2005, 04:24 PM

Now Cob,I hope you're joking there! If you had a good bullshit detector the needle should of been pointing left if you were watching that movie!!! Michael Moore is an idiot and I would give him credibility if 10% of that movie made sense, but it didn't. His next documentary should be about Las Vegas buffet lines!!!

Fraid not. I was sold for a couple days! What he was good at was using 75% truth and using my own passion against me. That movie wasn't full of lies but was full of mostly trues. For instance, some of the only flights allowed after the FAA grounded them was for BinLadins brothers to get out of the country. That part was a fact, but Moore suggested that Bush directly made it happen. That part isn't true. Bush isn't smart enough to make a flight happen! (sorry, couldn't help myself!)

That segment was mostly true.

>>Flyboy<<

10-08-2005, 06:49 PM

Fraid not. I was sold for a couple days! What he was good at was using 75% truth and using my own passion against me. That movie wasn't full of lies but was full of mostly trues. For instance, some of the only flights allowed after the FAA grounded them was for BinLadins brothers to get out of the country. That part was a fact, but Moore suggested that Bush directly made it happen. That part isn't true. Bush isn't smart enough to make a flight happen! (sorry, couldn't help myself!)

That segment was mostly true.

Actually Bush (depite what you read about him) flew F-102s in the Air Force, no inflating a record there. Those types of airplanes will kill you very quick if you don't know what you're doing - he hung up the flyboy gig when he started playing politician and decided the National Guard was beyond him....

But you were right about that fat bastard Moore - he's good at using 75% of the truth and using the 25% of his bullshit t get people to believe his leftist crap. Personally I hope he does a docudrama on Teddy Kennedy's drinking habits!

cob1639

10-10-2005, 12:54 PM

>>Flyboy<<

10-10-2005, 01:37 PM

There's still 75% truth though. He should have just said that there were flights for the binLadin family after the attacks - what kind of idiots would let the prime suspects family out of the country without questioning them?
That gets the same point across, that makes Bush look just as bad without making anything up. That dummy.

There were no flights, no family members of bin Laden leaving - that's just plain BS- the man can barely tell the thruth about his own name! Don't believe 5% of his crap, I thnk you're smarter than that Cob!!!!!

Here's a great link showing how much of a jerk-off this guy is. It's people like him who drove me away from the Democrat party.

http://www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htm

cob1639

10-10-2005, 10:36 PM

...um ok. If you say so.

>>Flyboy<<

10-10-2005, 10:46 PM

Moore made "Bowling for Columbine" and did the same things - presented a bunch of BS looking professionally credable with little or nothing to back it up with. He resfuses interviews or debuts - the man is a fat retart whose grave I will promptly urinate on upon his untimely cholesterol driven death!!! :D

cob1639

10-10-2005, 11:18 PM

Not like that post that Wallis sent. That was full of 100% truth.

But I digress!

>>Flyboy<<

10-11-2005, 07:16 AM

Not like that post that Wallis sent. That was full of 100% truth.

But I digress!

Apples and oranges - I bet Wallis ins't a fat slob wearing a worn out baseball cap!!!! :D

cob1639

10-11-2005, 07:24 AM

Apples and oranges - I bet Wallis ins't a fat slob wearing a worn out baseball cap!!!! :D

...And that is the main test of ones credibility - ones weight.

>>Flyboy<<

10-11-2005, 07:40 AM

...And that is the main test of ones credibility - ones weight.

No dummy - the ball cap! :p

cob1639

10-11-2005, 07:43 PM

No dummy - the ball cap! :p

If he had an Astros cap he'd be 100% credible.

>>Flyboy<<

10-11-2005, 08:20 PM

If he had an Astros cap he'd be 100% credible.

Ya think so?!? - I picture him wearing an off color Red Sox cap! :rolleyes:

Wallis

10-11-2005, 10:29 PM

Any cap that isn't a Yankees cap or a Dodgers cap is okay with me.

Sorry about the Red Sox "getting the boot," but I was "damn happy" that the Yankees are out.

Now, about those Astros! Are they up to it this time? I always like to root for the underdog, like the Athletics and the Indians. I love to see new blood in the Series.

So, who do we have playing?

Angels vs White Sox. I'll go for the White Sox, since they have been "dry" for a long time.

Astros vs. the Cardinals. Cardinals have "been there," so I'll root for the Astros.

If the Sox and the Astros play, I'm just going to enjoy the games and hope it goes seven. Any other combination, I'm going to root for the underdog (i.e., Sox or Astros).

cob1639

10-12-2005, 12:21 AM

Underdog. That is something Wallis and I can FINALLY agree on. (Unless the home team is involved!) I always say - rooting for the Yankees (or the Chicago Bulls or Dallas Cowboys of the 90's) is like rooting for the team with a huge lead with 30 seconds left or the bottom of the 9th with 2 outs and no one on base with the crappiest batter at the plate.

MUCH LIKE THE UNDERDOG POSITION THE ASTROS WERE ON SUNDAY!!!

Should I point out that NONE of them were at church?

Too bad the Cardinals are so freggin good. I fear they'll send us packing - AGAIN!

Could baseball be the great uniter? Not god, not religion, not politics - but BASEBALL?

>>Flyboy<<

10-12-2005, 09:04 AM

rooting for the Yankees (or the Chicago Bulls or Dallas Cowboys of the 90's) is like rooting for the team with a huge lead with 30 seconds left or the bottom of the 9th with 2 outs and no one on base with the crappiest batter at the plate.

YUP!!!!!!!!!!!! ;)

Wallis

10-20-2005, 01:17 AM

OOOH! Did I call it or did I call it!!! The White Sox and the Astros!!!

Let the beer and the popcorn flow!!! It's gonna be a great series, I just know it!!!

cob1639

10-20-2005, 01:45 AM

OOOH! Did I call it or did I call it!!! The White Sox and the Astros!!!

Let the beer and the popcorn flow!!! It's gonna be a great series, I just know it!!!

Yeah Baby!!! Great freaking call Wallis. The streets in this town are already flowing with beer...

Jon

11-11-2005, 06:31 AM

Watching the news is so disturbing. Calling the survivors of this horrific diaster "Looters"???

Did you not watch the news?

Where are the Christians in our Government? Isn't Jesus' message to help the sick and the poor? To not judgment on people but to love and try to understand them?

You apparently just thrive off of what our wonderful news media tells you, as opposed to, paying attention to what REALLY went on there. I can't grasp the magnitude of your mentality,or lack thereof,(which fits many UNEDUCATED people's in this Country) but hopefully you will wake up someday and educate yourself.

Where are the Christians?
There were MANY there to give aid to these people, RIGHT AFTER the hurricane was over with. These people WERE NOT ALLOWED in because of New Orleans Homeland Security. They were told that they didnt want them to be a "magnet" to the superdome and draw more people there. Get your facts straight before you start pointing fingers. You obviously aren't aware either, that the President did send a request to Blanco, to allow him to take control of the situation. She stated she "needed 24 hours to THINK about it." She also stated that she "didnt want the President to POLITICIZE the hurricane."

Where is the Government?

It was and is NOT the Presidents responsibility to step up to the plate UNLESS he is given authorization to do so. He tried, but, obviously was told NO. I think that you, as well as others, need to start paying attention to the facts, instead of just going on your little rampage and making yourself look like an uneducated bafoon. FEMA was NOT always a part of the federal government. It was the democrats who wanted it to be, NOW, they say, it should be a separate entity, which it should have ALWAYS been to begin with. You sit there and blame the President, however, you fail to realize WHY there is an establishment of government set up. Why do you think that you have state and local officials in each state? ANYONE with common sense realizes that its up to the GOVERNER AND MAYOR to conduct themselves accordingly and to take charge when such instances arise. You act like this was a huge surprise to New Orleans, when in fact, they KNEW FIVE DAYS that this hurricane was aiming for their city. Eighty percent of the population was able to get out!!! Dont hand me your BS about this being the Presidents fault. FIVE days they knew this was coming. IF you watched the news, THEY stated that this was going to be a devastating hurricane and that it was going to destroy New Orleans BEFORE it even got there. THEY SAID THIS, HOWEVER, the governer and mayor FAILED on THEIR levels to handle things properly, as the liberals usually tend to do. IF you have even browsed over the LA evacuation plan, you would see that they were to utilize ALL government vehicles to get those out of there that didnt have a way out. Did you NOT see all the busses under water? Did you NOT know that amtrak offered services, but were denied?? AGAIN, FIVE DAYS they knew this was coming and the mayor ordered a mandatory evacuation, how many days prior to this devastation????? Again, get your facts straight. I live in Florida and we have MANY hurricanes here. We do NOT sit here and blame the President, REGARDLESS of who the President is at the time, for every hurricane that hits us. We have a competent mayor and governor. We do not, nor did we, have people that conduct themselves as those people did. They ARE and WERE looters. REGARDLESS of what you think. I can understand if they took food/water, however, they were SEEN ON TV running with things that they shouldnt have been with. Televisions and shoes, for example, arent very edible now, are they??? Again, this is the problem with you, as well as, many other liberal minded idiots in this Country, you do not pay attention to the FACTS. You just go off of what is told by the idiotic media, who will tell you anything to gain "ratings" instead of standing back and saying, ok, let me think about this for a minute and put the pieces of the puzzle together.

They claim to be one... but in the face of a tragic diaster you see polticians dumbfounded doing NOTHING for the victims... The news media have been in Louisana waiting for 4 days... but our government can not get any of our Troops or National Guards to drop these victims (looters ) some freakin water! Food! Have some empathy for these starving, homeless people!!

The government is ONE body, however, there are MANY parts. Did you NOT pay attention in school? Do you think that the Governor and Mayor are there just for display??? GET REAL. The ONLY dumbfounded politicians there were the Governor and Mayor. She, Blanco, again, stated she didnt want the President to "politicize" this hurricane, however, I think that she, and her mayor, did a fine job at exploiting and politicizing this hurricane themselves. Then, to take the focus off of their stupidity, as usual, the race card was tossed in. Those people there werent just black people. There were MANY white people there as well. Again, if you knew ANYTHING about how the government works, it is up to the GOVERNOR to call in the National Guard, NOT the President, UNLESS he is given the authorization. He is NOT allowed to overstep them, unless told otherwise. Many were victims, MANY were looters and many there were just plain IGNORANT. Before the hurricane even hit, there were MANY people there, also, that REFUSED to leave. NOONE other than themselves, can be held responsible for THEIR decisions. Even AFTER the hurricane hit, TEN THOUSAND people were still there, in their homes, and STILL refused to leave. You want to blame THAT on the President as well???? Yea, so much for your "empathy."

What kind of response, from our strongly faith based CHEIF OF COMMANDER who rants and raves how important it is for him to make sure Americans are safe.... surrounding himself with government officials that instead of MOVING INTO IMMEDIATE ACTION or better yet, should have been prepared for this hurricane that everybody knew was going to hit, but instead of leading sits there defending,

"let's not put blame on anybody, there is no way to be prepared for a diaster this tragic"

or

"looting will not be tolerated!"

Again, your level of intelligence is astounding.

Our President needs to step aside and let someone who does have a way to be prepared or who has more productive ways of handling such tragidies than defending his inability to get the job done!

I think its people like YOU who need to step aside and start paying closer attention to whats going on in the REAL world. You seem to live in some sort of liberal fantasy land. It is just easier for you to sit and blame the President for everything. Do you blame him when you have a hangnail too?

He wants the respect and power to be our President but none of the responsibility! What is going on?????

Again, get your facts straight. He accepted responsibility. He ONLY accepted responsibility for the FEDERAL governments part. NOT for the state and local officials. I dont even know why he accepted the blame for something he wasnt really responsible for anyways, however, he did accept part of the blame.

Will this even "wake the people up" to how incompetent he is? Yes, people love him for his morality and his christianity... What about job performance?

I think its people like YOU who need to "wake up" to how ignorant you and others who think like you are. It is YOU who are blinded by YOUR ignorance, as opposed to knowing the facts.

He says that there will be success overcoming this tragidy - he has already failed... how can you take so long, and how many people died, waiting for you to respond???

It DEFINATELY wasnt him who failed. YOU failed. The people who THINK like you FAILED. FAILED to realize the FACTS. You insinuate that everything is his fault, when again, you dont even know how the system of government operates.

He's pretty good at planning vacations.... maybe he should work as a vacation planner instead!

How moronic.