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Old 11-18-2012, 07:36 PM   #31
emilynghiem
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Originally Posted by Wallis View Post
Well, that was a half-assed answer. Typical of many of your comments.

Eastern philosophy of hell is NOT eternal. You forgot that all-important fact. Hell is a "time" of puriication that a soul must go through before being put back on the wheel of life.

If you are going to use philosophies as examples, please be thorough and not misleading.
Hi Wallis: Sorry I don't mean to leave out half the details, which I didn't think affected the argument or main points in common.

Just because I don't mention all the specific details, as you have in your vast historic repertoire, doesn't mean I am denying or rejecting these. Sorry this wasn't clear.

Wallis, putting all the pieces together to line up, is like solving a Rubik's cube.
We could go on and on about all the wrong ways the colors DON'T line up.

Or we can focus on how to coordinate the ones that DO line up with each other.
Aligning the Green sides with the Green, the White with White, and Yellows
together. Eventually we can solve this thing, and show how all the pieces and angles lead to the same solution.

When we do have the puzzle solved, everyone will recognize the pieces line up.

Until then, we could argue forever that the "right way" or "faster way" to get there is to move this piece first or that one, or get the Red first or the Blue.
When we solve it, those steps won't matter so much as the finished solution.

Wallis, I am not going to haggle over every little thing, especially if it is not necessary in finding common points. [If you REALLY wanted to pick apart Buddhism, you could do that in one step, by just saying Buddha said don't even believe his words without proof, but if there is no proof he said that, you can't even attribute that advice to Buddha. So you are back at square one, big deal!]

I find more gets done by focusing on where our colors and sides line up.
Not the billion ways that the sides can be misaligned, which are almost infinite.
=================================================
So on that note, where I was with Wouldhe, I was trying to summarize where things are, with reaching points of agreement:

1. We agreed that FEAR was a root cause of religious projection
2. And that EGO is the cause of human downfall
And I was asking what is the third level
3. ???

Is it
* political division (such as between science and faith, secular and religious,
rich and poor)
* false speech teaching or religion
* war or oppression

How would you describe what causes the "root" problem internally
with someone (FEAR/ignorance instead of LOVE based on faith/truth)
to manifest "in relation" with others (EGO for control, instead of equal sharing for justice or reciprocity in relationships) and then "collectively" for all humanity.

What do you call either the good or the bad influence on the third level of
collective humanity?

If we can identify the positives/negatives on all three levels,
we can try to line up these values with the meaning of
* God/Christ/HolySpirit
* Satan/Antichrist/FalseProphet
and maybe get all six sides of this Rubik's cube to align,
both the positive sides and their opposite poles.

If we can agree what our general values are, both positives and negatives,
we could then discuss what methods or changes we recommend for addressing and correcting the ills of humanity while promoting the good for our future.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:20 PM   #32
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Emily,

Have you ever studied any form of debate? or debating?

It is obvious that you haven't. And I have students that can run circles around me!

If you are going to make a statement, you have to cover all the corners. You cannot drop a "bomb" and expect everyone to be thinking on the same page as you.

Greens, Yellows, and Whites.

There are no such things, Emily. Sorry, but the universe (or the individual universes of each and every human being) do not align itself (themselves) up to a given pattern.

What you call "green" is not going to be green to everyone, and it will not be green all the time. It pretty much is useless to try to make something green in the first place and then spend a tremendous amount of energy keeping it green.

I am going to start a new thread so that you might have an inkling of what I am talking about.
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Old 11-20-2012, 10:29 PM   #33
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Does that mean that "Hell" is running now-before the JUDGMENT?
Yes.

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If you go by Dr. Luke who said that the rich man was ALREADY suffering in "Hell" that that must be so. No?
Yes, he was suffering and wanted a drop of water. He's there awaiting the Judge.


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By the way, WHEN was Hell created? Any takers?
In the beginning hell was created. Remember, no evil, wicked, sinful person returns to live with God. The only time an evil person sees God is at the last judgement, where every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. And this is where the rich man will bow his knee. And he will be judged and sent to hell.
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Old 11-21-2012, 08:49 AM   #34
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Sapphire I think if you woke up tommorrow morning and found yourself living in Somalia, Sudan, Afghanistan, you would see that your definition of Hell is alive and well on planet earth.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:58 AM   #35
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Sapphire I think if you woke up tommorrow morning and found yourself living in Somalia, Sudan, Afghanistan, you would see that your definition of Hell is alive and well on planet earth.
God did not create hell on the face of the earth. generations of people are suffering the sins of their ancestors and their own sin. They worship false gods/idols and do evil things. Some were just born into it and suffer because the land is cursed. Don't blame God for that.
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Hebrews 3:4 - For every house is built by someone, but He who built all things is God.

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Last edited by Sapphire; 11-21-2012 at 12:00 PM.
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Old 11-21-2012, 12:06 PM   #36
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God did not create hell on the face of the earth. generations of people are suffering the sins of their ancestors and their own sin. They worship false gods/idols and do evil things. Some were just born into it and suffer because the land is cursed. Don't blame God for that.
Then who is to blame?
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Old 11-21-2012, 12:16 PM   #37
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Then who is to blame?
Read my quote again. the answer is right there.
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Old 11-21-2012, 02:31 PM   #38
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Read my quote again. the answer is right there.
If God cursed the land and they just happen to be born there how is that the fault of the people?
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:59 PM   #39
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If God cursed the land and they just happen to be born there how is that the fault of the people?
If a baby was born to a drug addicted mother, and suffered health problems...would that be God's fault? Her womb was cursed because she selfishly took drugs, and the baby suffered the consequences.

And the land is cursed because of idol worship and evil.
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Hebrews 3:4 - For every house is built by someone, but He who built all things is God.

John 8:47 - "He who is of God hears Godís words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.Ē
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Old 11-21-2012, 07:35 PM   #40
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If a baby was born to a drug addicted mother, and suffered health problems...would that be God's fault? Her womb was cursed because she selfishly took drugs, and the baby suffered the consequences.

And the land is cursed because of idol worship and evil.
If God created everything and knew that his creation would lead to evil in the world, then yes God is responsible. If God did not create, or did not know what would happen then God is not responsible.

Every being that is capable of understanding its own actions is responsible for those actions.
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