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Old 02-07-2013, 10:13 AM   #41
hrdguera
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So Plad ..... lets take a minute and blow your argument all to hell.

You have stated that we don't need guns because it is uncivilized in your fine but naive opinion.

So, why is our government purchasing enough ammunition to wage a full scale war for 30 years? Do you think they are preparing for battle against ...illegal aliens, Spanish Separatists, or maybe ragheads on camels looking for Coca-Cola in the desert?

http://www.infowars.com/dhs-purchase...of-ammunition/

"To put that in perspective, during the height of active battle operations in Iraq, US soldiers used 5.5 million rounds of ammunition a month. Extrapolating the figures, the DHS has purchased enough bullets over the last 10 months to wage a full scale war for almost 30 years."

...

While Americans are being browbeaten with rhetoric about the necessity to give up semi-automatic firearms in the name of preventing school shootings, the federal government is arming itself to the teeth with both ammunition and guns. Last September, the DHS purchased no less than 7,000 fully automatic assault rifles, labeling them “Personal Defense Weapons.”


It seems the only thing we have to fear is fear itself ....and our own government gone fucking crazy. So you can keep your polite rhetoric to yourself. I have little trust in a group of people whose only skill is that they conned a bunch of liberal dilettantes to vote for them because they either want something without working for it; like bread and circuses; or feel that a vote for the liberal idealogy will right some perceived social injustice from 200 years ago. I do take comfort that our founding fathers understood the baser desires of men and women in power and sought to protect us from such an event by seeing that we as citizens will always be able to bear arms.

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Old 02-07-2013, 10:28 AM   #42
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So, why is our government purchasing enough ammunition to wage a full scale war for 30 years?
Perhaps your government has future plans to invade yet another country that can't fight back and force it's idea of 'democracy' upon it.

....and how does that 'blow my argument to hell'??
On the contrary, I'd say that is blows YOUR argument to hell rather than mine! I mean, if your government has purchased enough ammunition to wage a full scale war for 30 years (presumably, according to you, with a view to oppress the populace) ...do you really think that your small civilian militia is going to be able to compete with that?

So, you have unwittingly blown yourself to hell not me....because there is no way in hell that your 'defenders of the constitution' are going to make any difference whatsoever against a government that is supported by an army that is armed with sophisticated weapons and enough ammunition to last for thirty years!!!!

Well there you are folks! Admittance that the 'excuse' that the American public need their guns to protect themselves from their 'tyrant' government is just plain...caca de vaca! It's time you started being honest lads and admit that the only reason for you hanging onto your toys is that you WANT to hang on to them.

Quod erat demonstrandum I think.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:33 AM   #43
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Perhaps your government has future plans to invade yet another country that can't fight back and force it's idea of 'democracy' upon it.
Could be. But if that was the case they would also be investing in planes and boats. Since they are not .... I guess you are safe over there, for now. At least we know that they don't plan on swimming across the oceans! Judging from the caliber of people I've encountered at the border entry points I doubt many of them can swim or even spell "swimming."
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:57 AM   #44
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Judging from the caliber of people I've encountered at the border entry points I doubt many of them can swim or even spell "swimming."
I had the same experience when I went to Boston last year. The dudes checking passports were the most ignorant fuckwits I have ever met in 34 years of globe-trotting.

BTW. There are no borders within Europe. Odd that isn't it...no borders or controls between European countries yet our streets are not swarming with armed criminal gunning us down as we are doing the weekly shopping!
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:46 PM   #45
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BTW. There are no borders within Europe. Odd that isn't it...no borders or controls between European countries yet our streets are not swarming with armed criminal gunning us down as we are doing the weekly shopping!
Well I guess you would not mind living in a place that borders Mexico. You like the strict gun laws they have and the brutal deaths at the hands of the Cartels, right?

Not that the US really guards its borders against the drugs and violence that are pouring in anyways.
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:29 PM   #46
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Well I guess you would not mind living in a place that borders Mexico. You like the strict gun laws they have and the brutal deaths at the hands of the Cartels, right?
What makes you say that? Have I ever said that I approve of brutal deaths or 'cartels'.

If Mexico can't enforce it's gun laws then it's not the fault of the gun laws. You can't argue that gun laws don't work because clearly they do...so it must be that the laws are not being enforced.
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:47 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by hrdguera View Post
So Plad ..... lets take a minute and blow your argument all to hell.

You have stated that we don't need guns because it is uncivilized in your fine but naive opinion.

So, why is our government purchasing enough ammunition to wage a full scale war for 30 years? Do you think they are preparing for battle against ...illegal aliens, Spanish Separatists, or maybe ragheads on camels looking for Coca-Cola in the desert?

http://www.infowars.com/dhs-purchase...of-ammunition/

"To put that in perspective, during the height of active battle operations in Iraq, US soldiers used 5.5 million rounds of ammunition a month. Extrapolating the figures, the DHS has purchased enough bullets over the last 10 months to wage a full scale war for almost 30 years."

...

While Americans are being browbeaten with rhetoric about the necessity to give up semi-automatic firearms in the name of preventing school shootings, the federal government is arming itself to the teeth with both ammunition and guns. Last September, the DHS purchased no less than 7,000 fully automatic assault rifles, labeling them “Personal Defense Weapons.”


It seems the only thing we have to fear is fear itself ....and our own government gone fucking crazy. So you can keep your polite rhetoric to yourself. I have little trust in a group of people whose only skill is that they conned a bunch of liberal dilettantes to vote for them because they either want something without working for it; like bread and circuses; or feel that a vote for the liberal idealogy will right some perceived social injustice from 200 years ago. I do take comfort that our founding fathers understood the baser desires of men and women in power and sought to protect us from such an event by seeing that we as citizens will always be able to bear arms.

Couldn't have said it better myself.
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Old 02-07-2013, 03:05 PM   #48
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Maybe...but would they have stopped them, that is the point.

History will tell you that the well armed French Resistance could not stop the might of the German army and in the same way, American Rambo wanabes are not going to stop the American army if it is supporting the government. If the army does not support the government then the government will not win and an armed citizenry will not be required. The army can manage the job on it's own.

I made no such assumption but by the law of averages there will be many that will....jut as there will be a huge number of your citizens that have guns who will turn them against YOU in support of the government. Just as there will be a huge number that won't have the stomach for a fight. Just as there will be a huge number that will start to fight and who then think 'sod this' after a few bullets have given them a new parting in their hair.


Listen pal. When people think they are going to 'get something out of it' your 'constitution' won't even be worth as much as the paper that you wipe your arse with.

OK, I won't...as long as you don't assume that there won't.

LMFAO!! Yeah! I can see them all now, throwing the covers off their F22 Raptors that they have stashed away in the back of their garages Oy vey!!! Do I really want to lower my intelligence to this!

Wake up pal. We are living in the 21st century not the 18th.

Yes it is..absolutely it is! It's a reality where people have realised that personal gun ownership is not necessary and where we can sit in a pavement cafe enjoying the warmth of the sun without the fear that we and or children are going to be gunned down. Here in Spain we have very strict gun laws. Are we at a disadvantage or less free than you guys in the U.S.? Let's see. Our rate per 100,000 for people murdered by guns is 0.15. If we compare that with your rate of 3.6, I think we can see where the 'reality' is..

But this is re-hashing old arguments. You have already been shown the figures, the scholarly articles and the verifiable evidence from around the world proving that countries that do not allow gun ownership have SIGNIFICANTLY lower death rates from guns than those who do allow guns. You have ignored that evidence so why should you take any notice of what I've just said??

YOU HOPE! How then, in countries where government coups have taken place, do the army support the government. Do you think that those soldiers have not taken vows of patriotism to their country? Most if not all armies do. There is a military camp near me with the motto 'My country first'...but it didn't stop them supporting the Franco dictatorship against the people.

Very funny.... I doubt very much that anyone has an F-16 or Stealth fighter sitting in their barn. If there are defectors or should I say soldiers, sailors, and airmen who take serious the oath that they took to defend the Constitution wouldn't they therefore confiscate jet fighters, tanks, armored vehicles and the like? I would suspect so....... If you would like to see something interesting put "Oath Keepers" into your Google search box.
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Old 02-07-2013, 04:05 PM   #49
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What makes you say that? Have I ever said that I approve of brutal deaths or 'cartels'.

If Mexico can't enforce it's gun laws then it's not the fault of the gun laws. You can't argue that gun laws don't work because clearly they do...so it must be that the laws are not being enforced.
The laws are being enforced on the law abiding citizens, the Cartels do not obey the laws and are starting to push the violence further into the USA from Mexico.

You brag about open borders and not having saftey issues because of the gun laws, well how about you move to Mexico and trust in the gun laws to protect you from the Cartels. Unless of course you know the laws will not protect you.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:08 PM   #50
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Here's the deal and Plad is right - sort of....

The discussion about an armed populace to keep the government in check is a difficult one and of course we know should it come to us against them that the government would break out its tanks, and bombers, and elite soldiers, everything it can to put down the rebellion - kind of like what Syria is experiencing right now. Here is the catch, just like using nukes as a deterrent to war, the armed populace keeps the government in check by the fact that should it ever come to that there would be a slaughter so unimaginable that the government would be reluctant to use its weapons. The fighting and death on both sides would be unimaginable. Potentially millions could be killed. So I think the armed populace does play a role in keeping the government in check.
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